Many of us have witnessed how rapidly and efficiently Google’s algorithm has evolved and matured. How to adapt? What matters most these days?
Let’s discuss!
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About Martin
Martin MacDonald @searchmartin is founder of MOGmedia and a digital marketing consultant with over 15 years experience in Startups to Fortune 500’s
Martin MacDonald @searchmartin runs a private digital marketing consulting practice. For more information, check: Martin Macdonald Digital Marketing Consultant
Questions we discussed
Q1 How did you become a digital marketer? Tell your career story!
So I kind of fell into digital marketing, which developed into SEO over a couple of years. The process started way back in ’96 when I delivered my first client website, and as early as 1997 I’ve found references to me offering Web Marketing Services.
Yesterday while I was trying to narrow down the dates, I found my first ever client website, and the second screenshot was the earliest mention I can find of me offering “Digital Marketing Services”, 21 years ago!
Worth noting, back then, I also used to offer “scanning services”
So, 21 years later, SEO has become the massive industry we work in today, and I fulfilled my ambition of playing with computers all day for a living!
1996? OMG that’s a long time in the industry! Who did you learn from when starting out? #vcbuzz
— Jessy Troy (@jessytroy) July 10, 2018
That was the thing – back then there was NOBODY to learn this stuff off. Maybe 20 people in the world were doing “SEO” way back then, we didnt have blogs, we didnt have forums, we didnt have social media etc.
Wow. That was 21 years ago? Funny how a lot of websites now still look a lot like that. They could still do with some great website design services. #VCBuzz
— Narmadhaa (@s_narmadhaa) July 10, 2018
Yup, to be fair, my webdesign skills never really progressed much further, but I was a coder at heart even back then, so my technical skills at least improved over the years!
Our original website looks similar on https://t.co/U54Yu1wWcw… so you were looking good for the 90s. #VCBuzz
— pair Networks (@pairnetworks) July 10, 2018
Q2 Last year you wrote this article on why SEO case studies are pointless. The section on ranking factors that do matter now caught my attention… So what are those factors?
Ranking factor studies have been hugely important for many years – but – I fear their utility is somewhat past sell by date. The thing is, Google has become complex enough for the ranking factors needed for any specific keyword, could be entirely different to any other even closely related keyword.
The reality is, PageRank & Content are the two things you need. On top of that there are another 200+ items that can *detract* from your ranking potential.
PageRank being largely misunderstood, could you define it? #vcbuzz
— Anna Fox (@manifestcon) July 10, 2018
@manifestcon Probably the best description I can give, was this video I put together WAY back in 2013: https://t.co/6p72oasQw1 #vcbuzz
— Martin MacDonald 🦖🇺🇸🇪🇸🇬🇧 🦖 (@searchmartin) July 10, 2018
This really became evident to me about 4-5 years ago, while working as head of SEO and Content for Orbitz Worldwide – the things we had to do to get flight landing pages to rank, were completely different to the things we had to do.
It was evident to us back then, that “ranking factors” were only relevant within the SERP set that you are competing in at the time. Certainly not a “universal” set of ranking factors.
That’s where these studies generally fall down, they imply causation on a wide set of keywords, based on data from a select few. IF on the other hand, you’re new to SEO, ranking studies can’t hurt, as they still give you a grounding in fundamentals needed.
what exactly were you doing to get commercial landing pages to rank? #curious #vcbuzz
— Jessy Troy (@jessytroy) July 10, 2018
If we’re talking way back in history – I used to operate link networks of hundreds of millions of links. Seriously. Like 300,000,000 links across about a million domains. If we’re talking more recently, its based on OTHER people in the serps…what I mean by that is: the first thing I do on ANY keyword, is analyze all the ranking factors for each and every competitor in the SERP set, and do a gap analysis. That then drives the strategy that we should take moving forward 🙂
What do you mean by “universal”? I always thought ranking factors were only meant for SERPs? #VCBuzz
— Narmadhaa (@s_narmadhaa) July 10, 2018
Honestly, not as much as you’d think – but thats really down to my typical client type: my business is focused on complex technical problems with massive (10s of millions of pages) global websites. So really for me, local isn’t a huge part of my business – it IS increasingly important for almost all SEOs however, as google continue to refine local searching. Its just not really in my priority list :/ sorry!
@searchmartin Link networks seem like a scam to game the system. Were they not? #vcbuzz
— Josh McCormack (@joshmccormack) July 10, 2018
They absolutely were! No arguments there, but, in an environment where “I get paid” in bulk linkbuilding, I’m going to find interesting ways to embed links.
In pharma there were “non branded” sites that had favorable articles that were promoted. These sites were even promoted via ads. There are many ways to generate traffic. Not all of them squeaky clean. #vcbuzz
— Josh McCormack (@joshmccormack) July 10, 2018
We are talking about many years ago when Google was asking us to get other webmasters link to us though 😉 RT @vcbuzz: RT @joshmccormack: @searchmartin Link networks seem like a scam to game the system. Were they not? #vcbuzz
— Ann Smarty (@seosmarty) July 10, 2018
#vcbuzz here's a GREAT example of my old linkbuilding from #mozcon 2012, where I built about 3 million links in less than five minutes, for an audience member, live on stage. https://t.co/S08GDQPYeO . I got in trouble with Google for that 😉
— Martin MacDonald 🦖🇺🇸🇪🇸🇬🇧 🦖 (@searchmartin) July 10, 2018
Q3 You’ve been in the industry for over a decade… How has organic SEO changed? What were some of its changes that got you most excited?
Depends who you ask really, from my perspective, having worked in gambling SEO for nearly a decade before moving into the corporate SEO world, the main thing that’s changed is that: Google got better.
They’re still not perfect, far from it, but crucially: in the old days (2002-2012) we searched for flaws in their ranking algo, we found tactics that enabled us to maximize the KPIs that were important to Google at the time. We ranked, competitively.
Google’s intent has always been to provide the best possible results. SEOs intent has always been to get their sites ranking…. To me at least, about 5 years ago, the inflection point came where it became easier to just build the best site for the query, **rather than trying to find ever more elaborate linking schemes**.
To put it simply: Google got better. ~ @joshmccormack #vcbuzz
— Ann Smarty (@seosmarty) July 10, 2018
@searchmartin So, it's easier to play by the rules from the very beginning rather than trying to outsmart them.. 🙂 #vcbuzz
— Sana Knightly (@SanaKnightly) July 10, 2018
Exactly!!! Unless you really know what you’re doing, and aren’t scared of breaking things.
@SanaKnightly Good to play by the rules, but that doesn't guarantee fantastic results. The trick might be to find exactly where the line is. #vcbuzz
— Josh McCormack (@joshmccormack) July 10, 2018
I doubt it's a straightforward signal BUT it may help us, marketers, to evaluate the link profile in general RT @joshmccormack: Are links from .edu as valuable as we're led to believe? #vcbuzz
— Ann Smarty (@seosmarty) July 10, 2018
Great great great question: “yes and no”, “it depends” 😉 Here’s the thing: edu domains by and large have lots of backlinks. have lots of content. tend to be good. By THAT measurement, edu links are better. BUT – its just the site, not the actual TLD
Interesting. I had been led to believe it was the TLD. They certainly are typically content heavy. #vcbuzz
— Josh McCormack (@joshmccormack) July 10, 2018
Thing is, I always ask myself: “WHY” would google place a “trust” flag on a TLD? There seems no decent reason, when PageRank by itself by design does what they want.
Q4 What’s the future of search engine optimization? Where are we heading? How should search experts adapt to keep their expertise and skill set valid going forward?
The future of SEO: that’s the million dollar question right? No pressure 😉 . So: for me, as long as we’re talking “10 blue links”, google have won that battle. Its not changing. What WILL change though is the very format of searching.
A great example right now is voice search, and featured snippets. It seems unlikely to me that in 20 years we’ll sit in front of desktop computers and choose a search result, after typing a query. It’s more likely that the very ecosystem of search will radically change. It’s going to be about ADAPTING to those changes first. I’d also hazard a guess that the most important asset in future will be owning the content that provides searcher answers. That simply. The org that owns the data, will be the answer.
What that looks like? Who knows. Not me. But its NOT going to look like 10 blue links. It’s time to invest in content, and being the “right answer” to queries, not focusing on seeking out % of ranking factors.
One thing that may throw a wrench into the whole wireless world is what percentage of people it makes so ill they can't use devices anymore @searchmartin #vcbuzz
— Gail Gardner (@GrowMap) July 10, 2018
TRUTH "It's time to invest in content, and being the "right answer" to queries, not focusing on seeking out % of ranking factors" (c) @searchmartin #vcbuzz
— Ann Smarty (@seosmarty) July 10, 2018
@searchmartin Let's say you write the perfect answers. But can Google find them with no incoming links? And what if Google scraps them onto a zero-result serp? Or Wikipedia "borrows" it? #vcbuzz
— Gail Gardner (@GrowMap) July 10, 2018
GREAT question. Right now, the answer is no. Having great content is table stakes, having PageRank to be first and get the Featured Snippet (in today’s iteration at least) is required. Hopefully, Google will improve on that. Don’t hold your breath though. If it ends up in a zero result serp, you’re screwed. That’s why I was SO passionate about trying to stop them. Pretty much same goes for wiki, but at least you can get an attribution link.
@searchmartin ok, so does domain PageRank alone do it or do you need individual PageRank? #vcbuzz
— Gail Gardner (@GrowMap) July 10, 2018
The very concept of “domain authority” only came about because we (SEOs) needed a better way to define internal pagerank flow. Google have always maintained that they only consider one PageRank score, on a per URL basis.
Writers need to attribute and link to ORIGINAL sources and not be part of the problem by linking to scrapers, even Wikipedia! @searchmartin #vcbuzz
— Gail Gardner (@GrowMap) July 10, 2018
Life, and SEO, are not a meritocracy. Great content will not rise to the top by itself. It needs to be optimized, promoted and connected. In short, the best answers might be on the 100th page. #vcbuzz
— Josh McCormack (@joshmccormack) July 10, 2018
Q5 What are your favorite search engine optimization and digital marketing tools?
Im a BIG fan of DIY tools. Excel, Filemaker, SQL, PHP. Those are my daily drivers. Tool wise, obviously @screamingfrog and @sitebulb are the best crawlers hands down. Saas Platform wise @ryte and @deepcrawl, and @semrush / @seoclarity for market intel.
A5: I love Serposcope. Open source SERP testing. Plug in IP addresses, CAPTCHA solving. Very powerful. #vcbuzz
— Josh McCormack (@joshmccormack) July 10, 2018
Truth is though, we’re INCREDIBLY lucky to have the diverse set of SEO tools in 2018 that we do. It does concern me though that new practitioners can depend on these tools without truly understanding the backend data models.
A5 @Serpstat @Semrush @Ahrefs @Spyfu – LOVE all of them and grateful for all the innovation each of them is bringing into our industry #vcbuzz
— Ann Smarty (@seosmarty) July 10, 2018
A5: (continued) on the featured snippets thing, I've been beta testing the Featured Snippet tool by @imninjas and its EXCELLENT: https://t.co/mj9J7BD4Ba #vcbuzz
— Martin MacDonald 🦖🇺🇸🇪🇸🇬🇧 🦖 (@searchmartin) July 10, 2018
Our previous search engine optimization chats:
- Essential Steps of an SEO Audit with @MattLacuesta #VCBuzz
- How to Combine SEO and Social Media w/ Anita Cohen @anitasearchguru #VCBuzz
- SEO Coaching and Findability Principles with Heather Lutze @HeatherLutze
- Domains and SEO: Myths and Tips with Bill Hartzer @bhartzer
- Marketing Twitter Chat with International SEO Consultant Aleyda Solis @aleyda
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